I made my first 44 AMP loads this weekend. Used new starline brass. They shot fine, but when I went to reload them I noticed that the cases had expanded to the point to where the bullet just drops right in to the bottom of the casing. Has anybody else had this problem? Any ideas of what caused it or how to fix it? Thanks.
I made my first 44 AMP loads this weekend. Used new starline brass. They shot fine, but when I went to reload them I noticed that the cases had expanded to the point to where the bullet just drops right in to the bottom of the casing. Has anybody else had this problem? Any ideas of what caused it or how to fix it? Thanks.
There is nothing wrong David, that is what happens when you fire the round. The powder ignites, the case expands to seal the case to the chamber walls, the bullet exits the barrel, and the case shrinks back a small amount and ejects.
To reload the case it must be resized and that is what the sizer die does. If you do not have a reloading manual outlining the steps to hand loading stop uhntil you get one. It is a simple proceedure, just follow the directions like a following a cooking recipe. The big difference is a cartridge loaded wrong can be dangerous to the gun and the shooter.
Do some homework before you go any farther. Good luck.
Made it to the range today with 50 rounds, with three different powder charges, pushing 240gr. jfp. I could not be happier, the pistol ran flawlessly with all loads. Loaded up another 100 rounds, as soon as I got home.
Seems as if my RCBS die set is missing the sizing die. Does anybody have one they'd be willing to sell?
Thanks.
David
Seems as if my RCBS die set is missing the sizing die. Does anybody have one they'd be willing to sell?
Thanks.
David
David,
Do you have the old 4-die set or newer 3-die set? The older resize die does not have the primer decapper so at first glance it could look like a crimp die
If you are truly missing the sizer it’s no problem. The parent case of the 44 AMP is 308 Winchester, which itself is an offshoot of the 30-06 and is related to 270 and many others. Any of those calibers have sizer dies that work perfectly for the 44 AMP. If you don’t have one, they are easily found on eBay.
Seems as if my RCBS die set is missing the sizing die. Does anybody have one they'd be willing to sell?
Thanks.
David
David,
Do you have the old 4-die set or newer 3-die set? The older resize die does not have the primer decapper so at first glance it could look like a crimp die
If you are truly missing the sizer it’s no problem. The parent case of the 44 AMP is 308 Winchester, which itself is an offshoot of the 30-06 and is related to 270 and many others. Any of those calibers have sizer dies that work perfectly for the 44 AMP. If you don’t have one, they are easily found on eBay.
Great info Pantera Mike! Let me try extrapolating from there. If one has a 44 Remington Magnum Die set and uses the Seating Die and Crimp Die from that set in combination with a 308 Sizer Die, Do I now have a setup to reload 44 AMP ammunition?
Seems as if my RCBS die set is missing the sizing die. Does anybody have one they'd be willing to sell?
Thanks.
David
David,
Do you have the old 4-die set or newer 3-die set? The older resize die does not have the primer decapper so at first glance it could look like a crimp die
If you are truly missing the sizer it’s no problem. The parent case of the 44 AMP is 308 Winchester, which itself is an offshoot of the 30-06 and is related to 270 and many others. Any of those calibers have sizer dies that work perfectly for the 44 AMP. If you don’t have one, they are easily found on eBay.
Great info Pantera Mike! Let me try extrapolating from there. If one has a 44 Remington Magnum Die set and uses the Seating Die and Crimp Die from that set in combination with a 308 Sizer Die, Do I now have a setup to reload 44 AMP ammunition?
I had a set of 44 AMP Dies that was missing the sizer die. My RCBS 30-06 and 270 dies both worked well resizing the 44 AMP cases. The 308 case does not taper like the 30-06 and 270 and did not work, I tried it.
Google the cartridge drawings for all of the cartridges and you will see the difference.
I do not think that the 44 Remington Mag bullet seating die would work on 44 AMP either although I have not tried it. The 44 AMP case is tapered and it is larger at the base than the 44 Mag. I do not think the bullet seating die will go over the 44 AMP case.
Also, I have found that a good "taper crimp" is very important to the cartridge feeding properly on 44 AMP's. The 44 Mag die will give it a "roll crimp" like is used on revolver loads.
Google the cartridge drawings for all of the cartridges and you will see the difference.
Given the vast gulf between your tremendous experience and knowledge and mine, I’m not fit to argue that assertion. I’ve only contemplated the question theoretically. Looking at 30-06 and 270 drawings, they both measure .470” at the base of the body of the case, and .441” at the bottom of the neck, over a length of 1.948”, which indicates a certain amount of taper. Meanwhile, the 308 also measures .470” at the base, but is larger at .454” at the bottom of the neck. However that distance is only 1.560”, which also indicates a certain amount of taper.
I’m woefully deficient in math skills and thus can’t calculate to see if the taper is the same, although I was always led to believe it was. It would be interesting to calculate what the measurement at 1.560” is on the 30-06 case?
I only have a 308 sizer die. Someday I’m going to try comparing cases sized with that versus an original steel (not carbide) 44 AMP die and see what, if any difference there is.
I also have a friend who found his original 44 AMP steel die didn’t produce enough neck tension so he switched to a 270 sizer, which produced a noticeably smaller inside neck diameter.
I do not think that the 44 Remington Mag bullet seating die would work on 44 AMP either although I have not tried it. The 44 AMP case is tapered and it is larger at the base than the 44 Mag. I do not think the bullet seating die will go over the 44 AMP case.
Also, I have found that a good "taper crimp" is very important to the cartridge feeding properly on 44 AMP's. The 44 Mag die will give it a "roll crimp" like is used on revolver loads.
Full disclosure, I am waiting for the new die sets to be offered. However, if the zombies attack before then we will need a plan B. I'm thinking that the sizer is the biggest hurdle. The larger base can be handled with the 308/30-06 shell plate. If sizing is covered by a 30-06 sizer (got that one too), I'm thinking that I can seat the bullet with a 44 mag seater die without creating a roll crimp and then use a 44 taper crimp die sold by Lee in the last stage of my press. Do you think it would be worth a try or a bad idea?
https://www.amazon.com/LEE-PRECISION-90784-Die-44-Special/dp/B00162RUM2
I do not think that the 44 Remington Mag bullet seating die would work on 44 AMP either although I have not tried it. The 44 AMP case is tapered and it is larger at the base than the 44 Mag. I do not think the bullet seating die will go over the 44 AMP case.
Also, I have found that a good "taper crimp" is very important to the cartridge feeding properly on 44 AMP's. The 44 Mag die will give it a "roll crimp" like is used on revolver loads.
Full disclosure, I am waiting for the new die sets to be offered. However, if the zombies attack before then we will need a plan B. I'm thinking that the sizer is the biggest hurdle. The larger base can be handled with the 308/30-06 shell plate. If sizing is covered by a 30-06 sizer (got that one too), I'm thinking that I can seat the bullet with a 44 mag seater die without creating a roll crimp and then use a 44 taper crimp die sold by Lee in the last stage of my press. Do you think it would be worth a try or a bad idea?
https://www.amazon.com/LEE-PRECISION-90784-Die-44-Special/dp/B00162RUM2
Call Lee and see if they think their 44 Mag taper crimp die will go down far enough over the tapered 44 AMP case to crimp the neck, they have all the cartridge drawings.
Before I would do that I would test to see if your 30-06 die sizes the case, make sure your 44 Mag flaring die will flare the neck, and the the 44 Mag bullet seating die will go down far enough to seat a bullet. You have a lot of places to fail I'm afraid.
If you happen to telescope a bullet down into your case while firing, you could ruin your gun and hurt yourself. Those $300 to $400 dies on Ebay would look pretty cheap. 😉
I do not think that the 44 Remington Mag bullet seating die would work on 44 AMP either although I have not tried it. The 44 AMP case is tapered and it is larger at the base than the 44 Mag. I do not think the bullet seating die will go over the 44 AMP case.
Also, I have found that a good "taper crimp" is very important to the cartridge feeding properly on 44 AMP's. The 44 Mag die will give it a "roll crimp" like is used on revolver loads.
Full disclosure, I am waiting for the new die sets to be offered. However, if the zombies attack before then we will need a plan B. I'm thinking that the sizer is the biggest hurdle. The larger base can be handled with the 308/30-06 shell plate. If sizing is covered by a 30-06 sizer (got that one too), I'm thinking that I can seat the bullet with a 44 mag seater die without creating a roll crimp and then use a 44 taper crimp die sold by Lee in the last stage of my press. Do you think it would be worth a try or a bad idea?
https://www.amazon.com/LEE-PRECISION-90784-Die-44-Special/dp/B00162RUM2
Call Lee and see if they think their 44 Mag taper crimp die will go down far enough over the tapered 44 AMP case to crimp the neck, they have all the cartridge drawings.
Before I would do that I would test to see if your 30-06 die sizes the case, make sure your 44 Mag flaring die will flare the neck, and the the 44 Mag bullet seating die will go down far enough to seat a bullet. You have a lot of places to fail I'm afraid.
If you happen to telescope a bullet down into your case while firing, you could ruin your gun and hurt yourself. Those $300 to $400 dies on Ebay would look pretty cheap. 😉
Don't try this at home kids! 😉
I do not think that the 44 Remington Mag bullet seating die would work on 44 AMP either although I have not tried it. The 44 AMP case is tapered and it is larger at the base than the 44 Mag. I do not think the bullet seating die will go over the 44 AMP case.
Also, I have found that a good "taper crimp" is very important to the cartridge feeding properly on 44 AMP's. The 44 Mag die will give it a "roll crimp" like is used on revolver loads.
Full disclosure, I am waiting for the new die sets to be offered. However, if the zombies attack before then we will need a plan B. I'm thinking that the sizer is the biggest hurdle. The larger base can be handled with the 308/30-06 shell plate. If sizing is covered by a 30-06 sizer (got that one too), I'm thinking that I can seat the bullet with a 44 mag seater die without creating a roll crimp and then use a 44 taper crimp die sold by Lee in the last stage of my press. Do you think it would be worth a try or a bad idea?
https://www.amazon.com/LEE-PRECISION-90784-Die-44-Special/dp/B00162RUM2
Call Lee and see if they think their 44 Mag taper crimp die will go down far enough over the tapered 44 AMP case to crimp the neck, they have all the cartridge drawings.
Before I would do that I would test to see if your 30-06 die sizes the case, make sure your 44 Mag flaring die will flare the neck, and the the 44 Mag bullet seating die will go down far enough to seat a bullet. You have a lot of places to fail I'm afraid.
If you happen to telescope a bullet down into your case while firing, you could ruin your gun and hurt yourself. Those $300 to $400 dies on Ebay would look pretty cheap. 😉
Don't try this at home kids! 😉
Or, hold my beer, guy, while I try this.
I received an email from Starline Brass today asking me call them to update my credit card info that is attached to my .44 AutoMag brass order.
Important: Their order placement system can only hold credit card info for 30 days. After that the order is cancelled. The good news is that they are notifying those of us that are back ordered to call them. Better yet, is that the 30 day credit card hold issue means that they will be running .44 AutoMag brass in the next 3-4 weeks!!
Have a great weekend all!!
Google the cartridge drawings for all of the cartridges and you will see the difference.
Given the vast gulf between your tremendous experience and knowledge and mine, I’m not fit to argue that assertion. I’ve only contemplated the question theoretically. Looking at 30-06 and 270 drawings, they both measure .470” at the base of the body of the case, and .441” at the bottom of the neck, over a length of 1.948”, which indicates a certain amount of taper. Meanwhile, the 308 also measures .470” at the base, but is larger at .454” at the bottom of the neck. However that distance is only 1.560”, which also indicates a certain amount of taper.
I’m woefully deficient in math skills and thus can’t calculate to see if the taper is the same, although I was always led to believe it was. It would be interesting to calculate what the measurement at 1.560” is on the 30-06 case?
I only have a 308 sizer die. Someday I’m going to try comparing cases sized with that versus an original steel (not carbide) 44 AMP die and see what, if any difference there is.
I also have a friend who found his original 44 AMP steel die didn’t produce enough neck tension so he switched to a 270 sizer, which produced a noticeably smaller inside neck diameter.
Mike, it is the dimension at the length of a 44 AMP case that matters in this case. It is simply a matter of ratios to determine that.
The dimension of the 30-06/270 case at the 1.298" point is .451".
The dimension of the 308 case at the 1.298" point is .457".
Using my dies the 30-06/270 sized the case down .001 smaller than the 44 AMP die.
The 308 die sized the brass down .003" larger than the 44 AMP. That will not hold the bullet.
